Pros & Cons of Going Mullet? Carbon, Alloy or Steel Bikes? Essential MTB Tools?... Ep. 125 [Podcast]

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ladies and gentlemen welcome to episode 125 of the MTB podcast presented and hosted by worldwide cycy I am Jared I am
0:13
Liam I Jeff I skipped you what yeah he did is it normally the other way around
0:19
yeah I wasn't paying attention I know uh in this episode we will discuss
0:27
why centerlock rotors require require a PhD in engineering to get the right
0:32
lockering that's a little of a exaggeration but is it though well well we'll discuss later and we'll see yeah
0:39
we'll see who yeah yeah I mean I'm I'm currently not riding a new bike that I've been wanting to ride because of a
0:44
centerlock rotor lockering Liam's no longer top secret
0:51
trip to Germany and what he did there the bikes and rides we've been enjoying lately plus listener questions ranging
0:58
from essential tools to travel with latte or espresso and should you go with carbon or alloy for your next bike which
1:05
we've talked about carbon or alloy carbon or alloy and a lot of people have but you know what it almost changes every year yeah allo allo bikes get
1:12
better carbon bikes change it's true you need to warm up the I need to warm up the mouth I was uh you're distracted I
1:18
was distracted yeah come on get in the game there couple sips of this beverage too quickly he's
1:25
wasted 10 minutes sling my words already wasted all right give me I'm let
1:31
me gain my composure you read the first segment all right the first segment Zach's words of wisdom always bet 100 on
1:38
black it's unbelievable which he's never done that anytime you goes he has yeah
1:44
every time you go to casino go to the rulette table $100 on black guarantee you win it's not guaranteed guarantee
1:51
you it's not guarante he he says 757 time you'll win so you go in you put 100
1:57
on black and he's like he's like I've won more than I've lost so just do that and then you just walk away and then he probably goes and
2:03
spends his $200 on penny slots for the rest of the night for the record I took advice last time I was in Vegas I took
2:09
the advice and I won and I walked away $100 richer we're going to need to put one of those financial disclaimers like
2:16
this does not constitute investment advice yeah that's right oh followed by
2:22
Daniel's fun fact Australia is wider than the moon pretty cool sounds like there's
2:28
probably a lot of things wider than the moon in that case then well I was going to say the best Your
2:35
mom joke oh dang oh yeah that's kind of that's kind of wild yeah I mean if you
2:40
think about it you don't really think of Australia as being that big right I mean but it's huge I don't know I don't know I've never been to Australia I haven't
2:47
been there but I also just imagine it being massive like like they i' I've heard another fun
Fun Fact
2:53
fact that like Sydney to Perth is like further than like all kinds of diff
2:59
distances and the world yeah actually fun fact fun fact I think I'm pretty sure an Australian listener emailed in
3:06
after I talked about the San Antonio fact he's like think Texas is Big yeah
3:12
exactly he started rattling off these Australia things let me tell you about Australia
3:18
mate man we got to go there we should we do yeah we do do I'd love to obviously
3:23
hit Mainland Aussie but I I really want to hit a New Zealand and a tazzy trip that's like top of my
3:30
next trips Phil uh wanted to put on a a tazzy trip o but I don't know if it's
3:37
going to work out in 2024 but maybe 2025 he is going to do basically the same
3:42
dolomites Italy trip that we did but a little refined version so if any of you
3:48
listeners are interested we're not going to be there this time around but uh it's going to be an awesome trip probably
3:53
better than the one we did cuz it'll be exactly what we did but just a more refined version of it not that ours
3:59
wasn't finded but there was a couple things that I think they learned in terms of takeaways of which rides to do what day and that sort of thing I mean
4:05
you could do that trip five times and you'll learn something on a fourth trip to make the fifth trip better right like
4:11
that's just how those trips go so well said yeah speaking of riding bikes how
4:16
about the bikes and rides we've been enjoying lately yeah well I'll go last cuz mine leads into the the first topic
4:21
regarding centerlock rotor woses so why don't you go you you haven't
4:27
ridden in a while cuz you were you were sick under the and now you came back swinging I Jared was down bad I was down
4:33
bad I rode actually right before I got sick and you know funny enough it might have been exactly why I got sick because
4:40
I thought it would be CU it was like raining uh you know a couple weeks ago
4:45
and I was like oh man I'm going to I'm going to go ride in the rain with my
4:51
with my you know shell on and it was so fun and there was a couple of the guys out there and we were just like
4:58
yeah like we were loving it it was awesome I had such a great time and I was actually riding the Banshee Prime
5:04
and I was like all right I'm going to go shred this bike and it was super fun um and I was fine I felt like okay the next
5:09
day whatever not great but I was like went for a night ride the next day and the day after that woke up the sore throat and that's like when the whole
5:14
thing started but speaking of the prime it might have been a contributing factor but I don't think that's why you got I'm
5:20
sure I was already like compromised and then I was just like yeah here you go immune system yeah um but that Prime was
5:27
prime prime prime dude Prime super sick loved that bike really fun Banshee Prime
5:33
Banshee Prime yeah what is that 125 travel
5:38
13550 135 rear 154 had that memorized you should know that dude I should have had it memorized
5:45
I'm pretty sure I thought it one of the three of us should had it memorized we've all wrote that Pon enjoyed it bring it up faster Jee um 135 mil travel
5:53
okay but what Fork was on it the one we hadp but how much travel on it like the I think 150 15
6:00
150 in the front and 135 in the back I love that travel range of bike 130 mil
6:06
travel 29er is such a good one quiver setup pedal super well quiver kill pedal
6:12
super well the rear suspension on that bike I mean I'm sure it's the same way with the Titan like just how well that re suspension works it really works good
6:19
um yeah just like super efficient great pedaling platform but then like once you start kind of pushing it and like that
6:26
suspension yeah oh my God it just works super well yeah once I got everything kind of dialed in it just felt super
6:31
good just really well-rounded bike it was super fun yep um agreed yeah I was
6:36
just like man this thing rocks that riding that bike and then riding that Titan is just it's just one of those things to me I ride that and it really
Banshee
6:43
reminds me it's like wow these bikes from these small boutique mountain bike brands are in every way shape and form
6:49
as good and arguably better than the biggest of the biggest brands out there that are putting you know all this money
6:56
in marketing and hype and graphics and paint it's just like there's small BRS making bikes better than yours
7:02
and that's that's cool cuz there's not many Industries where there's contenders like that where you even contend like
7:07
that the way that Banshee does with the bike industry which which is just rad I love speak of Banshee they the US guys
7:15
came out and visited us Brian and Michael last week and got off for a ride with them it's just cool to hear some of
7:20
the just like more detailed facts that I don't think Banshee does a great job
7:25
about telling people so we're here to tell them about it just like some of their hydroforming they do on their
7:31
frames and they use 7,000 series aluminum hydroformed which like no one else is doing that like no other bike
7:38
brands are using 7,000 series hydroformed alloy and Welding that um
7:45
and like their CNC like hydroformed areas for their shocks and their bottom brackets and
7:50
where all that mounts like it's just crle so rad it's so you know well thought out Works super well yeah yeah
7:58
and you know just hearing those little things and and I also asked them cuz I was curious cuz all their bikes right
8:04
they're what is it the forgot the short travel bike name do you know Spitfire no
8:10
phant no want to say Phantom or uh there's a Spitfire and a phantom
8:15
115 rear travel 115 rear travel 29 is that the
8:20
hard that's a hard tail yeah the prime and the Titan they look like they could share the same platform right right as
8:27
and I asked them Phantom is 115 Phantom so Phantom Prime Titan look like they could share the same platform and even
8:34
the 27 bikes like maybe they share the front triangle and he said none of them at all share triangles or rear ends
8:41
really I think he said or one or two of them might share rear end but he said
8:46
they're all pretty much unique um and they share some hardware parts like some
8:52
some bearing and bolts and pivot bolts um but for the most part they're completely unique as well so I oh that's
8:59
cool cuz you know you see a lot lot of brands that share triangles like that and it's like is that the best bike or
9:05
is that to save costs you know which obviously for a small brand you have to save costs like those are really
9:11
expensive jumps to get into a complete bike but the big brands are doing that more exactly cuz that little bit of oh
9:18
we'll save the mold and use it for these three models is more meaningful when you make a, bikes a year rather than 100
9:23
well yeah you know a million bikes a year rather than 100 so yeah um I just thought that was really cool to hear
9:29
kind of all these details and stuff about Banshee that you know go a little bit Untold yeah so super cool bike yeah
9:36
that was fun nice yeah so that was it you rode the prime and then you and then
9:41
you I the prime and then I got sick yeah oh my God it was horrible and then I went for a ride on Saturday just like
9:47
into syamore on my druid and that was did you feel relatively okay uh my yeah
9:53
actually yeah like just sometimes if I ride after being sick it takes even if you're like oh I feel better now and
9:58
then you go for ride you're like wow I still just don't like I don't feel myself sure did not have the endurance
10:03
um ex and I just was like so tired I went for like an hour and I was just like so zuned the rest of the day like
10:10
this is not cool yeah but yeah I mean recover time it's it's just annoying but yeah I mean on that note it's super fun
10:16
to just like get out on the Druid and like I don't know after you don't ride for a while you just like pick up your bike and you're like oh man this thing
10:21
is so sick and like and then you go ride like one of your favorite Trails you're like oh man this so fun like gosh great
10:28
is so fun more people should do this bikes are good bikes are good yeah it was just fun you know especially after
10:33
being sick and like cooped up for like a week you know y just like wow what about you guys huh um Will's been putting in
Ranger
10:41
the miles I've been putting in some miles a lot on the actually a lot most miles and rides on my Ranger which has
10:48
just been you know Workhorse in it about in the locals but uh I rode my rail 29
10:56
uh on Saturday with some friends and we rode out um on the east side of Cano
11:01
Valley and it was really fun dirt was still pretty good and it's just really
11:06
fun to ride like the trail bike on trails that weren't a good trail bike for sure the Steeps and stuff yeah some
11:13
of the Steeps and and stuff out that way so nice yeah it's fun we got in like a I think we did like a 5k day on trail
11:20
bikes sick um so yeah got a bunch of good downhill laps and I just really like that bike that ra 29 is such a good
11:26
all round bike 5K day might not makes sense to some people uh 5,000 ft of
11:32
elevation climbing and descending there you go all on a pedal bike I thought you rode 3.1
11:39
miles yeah 5,000 ft up 5,000 ft down on bikes see one thing we do at the MTB
11:45
podcast is we want to help um you know the general mountain biker understand random terms like oh I did a 5k a day
11:52
yeah you know when guys like Liam just like shoot it off and don't realize or when like oh just riding this 140 El
11:57
suicide Trail it's like okay what do you mean by 140 what trail is that I'm trying to just make sure people people
12:04
learn little takeaways and they're like oh I know what that means now get them the urban dictionary of mountain biking
12:10
but the appropriate version I don't know why this is a little tangent but similar
12:15
like when people say oh yeah it's my 150 bike but it's a 150 Fork but it's 130
12:21
rear I always think that's wrong yeah that it's not really like a right or a wrong but in my head I just think it's
12:27
wrong because to me that refers to your rear travel not much always referring to
12:32
the rear travel some people like oh no it's my 150 bike and it's like you have a 15 154 but you only have 130 in the
12:39
rear so 130 is going to hurt down this Trail I thought you were bringing a 150 bike that might feel good you know right
12:44
I saw a bike on pink bike that was actually named after the front for travel I was like that doesn't make any sense why you do that what bike some
12:51
super obscure like like you know one of those brands that you pop up and you're like oh never heard of that bike brand
12:56
and then you know I wonder why I'm offended but uh yeah that ra 29 and a
13:03
half is good yeah it's cool one of those one day yeah those real 29s do look
13:09
sweet I would like to build one of those some point there's just a lot of bikes I want to build right now say you got like
13:14
couple bikes on the to front of your mine that you want me to build so when are you going to build that uh forbidden huh the dreid I don't know I do really want to
13:21
build one of those forbid I think you should make it white a white one I was also looking at Jared's bike the other
13:27
day and uh the paint is so nice to have them just to get a brand new forbidden the
13:34
paint is so well done just have someone rip it right off have techar rip it right off and make it white makes sense
13:41
but also at the same time the paint's so nice especially that black one it's like all sparkly and yeah that thing is so
13:47
cool yeah it's hard to rip off paint that's that good yeah I was uh somebody's got to do it I was R yeah
13:53
someone's going to do it I was riding your bike when when you out of town oh were you yeah just when I filmed a little stupid Instagram story about the
14:00
Black Friday sale and I just riding around the shop on your bike filming myself rid's great huh yeah it's rides
14:06
great that was my big ride lately just riding around the showroom with a shop filming Instagram stor the segue to that
14:13
yeah that was the segue you did a good ride last weekend yeah I did yeah I rode I rode put in decent ride on the ranger
Ranger Ride
14:19
um got out when the dirt was really good cuz we got just a random decent amount of rain and the dirt was awesome so good
14:24
that day and it was I should say yeah yeah it was it was nearly perfect I
14:29
think there was a couple spots where it was actually a little too muddy and kind of cake the tires but for the most part
14:34
it was Flawless 98% of the ride was perfect yeah it was fun I hadn't done like a longer local ride in a while and
14:41
wanted to just get out and spend some time on the ranger which was fun um but what I've been wanting to ride is the
14:47
Revel Rover oh yeah gravel bike MH freshly built in the back there in a
14:53
custom one-off blue color from Revel wow all black components it looks so good
14:58
good it looks sick but but Center lock rotor issue what's up with Center loock
15:04
rotors man and lock Rings well for starters I'm I don't like Center loock rotors just to begin with at all like if
15:09
I had a choice I'd never use them um occasionally they come I won't say they're bad but I've just seen so many
15:16
more of those come loose than sixbolt rotors right I don't know if I've ever even witnessed I've heard people they're
15:21
like oh I've seen a six bolt rotor come loose and I'm sure it's happened but I've never seen it in my entire life
15:27
ever and I seen at least 10 centerlock rotors come loose yeah and it's just
15:33
annoying when they do because you don't have the tool no for starters there's two different tools there's either a bottom bracket tool or a cassette tool
15:39
depending on which Center Center lock ring lock ring you have and then if a if
15:46
a six BT rotor comes loose everybody's multi-tool has a T25 on it so I'm just not a fan of centerlock I don't disagree
15:52
with any of your points however I do love traveling with centerlock however well there yeah when
15:58
you have the tool it's nice to take on and off even though you have to take an extra tool with you traveling but yeah
16:03
it is nice having just one tool the convenience of installation is nice yeah yeah now yeah along the lines uh
16:12
building this bike is a bit of my uh lack of planning a little bit um I
16:19
kind of like compuzzled well yeah I kind of compuzzled this bike together with like a bill kit from Revel and like some
16:24
other stuff I ordered on the own and like I wasn't really sure what the bill kit came with with so like I got it and
16:29
like oh don't Unbreak bolts or I don't have rotors or you know and then I got them and then I order the rotors and
rotors
16:35
then the rotors don't come with lock Rings because no one can make up their mind whether you sell a center loock
16:41
another problem with Center loock rotors some with the lock rings and some aren't some rotors come with lock rings and
16:46
some don't and then some Shimano rotors come with lock rings for a 200 mil rotor that doesn't work with mountain bike
16:53
hubs because it uses the cassette internally splined lockering tool vers
16:58
versus the externally spined bottom racket tool and those don't work with 15 mil axles different lock ring typ you
17:05
typically put a 200 mil rotor so Shimano I don't know what you're doing
17:12
um and that being said samam just often doesn't come with lock rings at all so
17:17
cuz they don't know what you have they assume your hubs are going to come with them and the hubs assume the rotors are maybe just they assume everyone assumes
17:23
you're supposed to get them separately I don't know no one's communicating with each other L I don't know so so I got I
17:29
got down to all right I need breake bolts got them got the correct ones need lock ring rers got them ordered the wolf
17:36
tooth ones I think they are sick M uh I have them too yeah so I ordered them up literally Jeff's like can you finish my
17:42
bike finishing it right now and I run back there putting stuff on and he's
17:47
watching me and I'm like brakes are bled everything I just need to adjust the brakes and I tighten up the front uh the
17:53
front axle and I go spin the front wheel and it doesn't move I'm like okay what's rubbing
17:59
I look down and the lock ring the way it's it's not really a fault of anyone it's not a fault really of it's just a
locking rings
18:06
combination of faults of where the flat Mount bolts are and
18:12
the carbon has to bulge around the bolt is in a perfect bold spot to run into
18:17
the externally splined lockering rotor so you need the internally splined one for this bike and I just bought the
18:23
external ones just thinking those are the ones we normally always ones I use on mountain bikes mountain bikes that
18:29
have 15 M have my grav bikes shouldn't be an issue right well it makes the ever so slightest contact so I pull that off
18:36
and I had to order internally splin ones and that was on Wednesday before Thanksgiving and nothing on Thanksgiving
18:42
and nothing has been open until today so they got ordered today in other words if you've ever
18:48
built a bike yourself or dealt with any type of these weird compatibility issues or strange things like this uh don't
18:55
feel bad about yourself and this will never end even if you own a shop if you work in a shop if you're around a bunch
19:01
of people who have a collective Century of worth of time in the bike industry you will still run into problems where
19:06
you can't ride your bike because you got X Y and Z doesn't X Y and Z is not compatible isn't compatible yep so
a conundrum
19:13
hopefully let's say Wednesday that bike is riding perfect time for Jeff to leave on his next trip and not ride it for a
19:19
week yeah for oh my God what all right Kur
19:26
fuffle conundrum fuffle conundrum I know insane I know oh well B looks really
19:32
good you know what if I was six bullet you just walk on down to the old Home Depot and uh just kidding get yourself a
19:38
little T25 and pop it in there or just grab one of our or grab one of the million back there million back there
19:44
you know Trail one titanium rotor bolt plug there you go multiple colors available perfect opportunity for a
19:51
trail one Center lock lockering I've thought about it I don't know man it's it's on the list of a
19:57
maybe what an ordeal yeah yeah that was an ordeal and that's why you need a PhD in engineering to get the right
20:03
lockering yeah yeah it's a bit of a stretch you just PhD in bike component compatibility yeah that's true actually
20:11
to get a PhD you have to write some paper with some big thesis or something right like this could be the thesis so
20:17
could be compatibility who who should take the onus of does the bike and the hubs come with the lock rings does the
20:24
rotor come with the lock Rings like who provides the lock the right lock Rings actually legit seems legit I think we
20:29
could make it happen I think the hubs should come with them because if it's a hub that has 12 well not really though
20:35
because it's a hub with a 12 mil or right you know then it should come with the internally SP comes with both and
20:41
then you pick whichever one works on your bike that's wasteful that's true the environmental
20:47
come the problem is I don't really know how to solve this so yeah cuz it is kind of a conundrum no matter which way you
20:53
go but speaking of engineering you went to Germany to visit the Ram I guess that
20:59
would be considered the European headquarters there just outside of Frankfurt or I guess quasi in Frankfurt
21:05
um outside of Frankfurt technically in schiner schiner um yeah I went there
21:11
back in February of 2020 right before yeah the world shut down and you went to you went to same location right same
21:16
location yeah you stay at the B&B hotel right across the way I don't even remember at this point did you walk
21:22
there uh I think so from the hotel yeah yeah I just I've rolled in this hotel late and I've seen BMB Hotel because
21:28
they sponsor road bike team but like a lot of these Brands I see sponsor roadbike teams I don't know what they are until I get to your European brand
21:35
right so um yeah uh anyways I went to
swam testing facility
21:40
swam for a lot of stuff that I can't talk about yet um but a lot of see cool
21:47
new products cool new product um but that facility is incredible they took you on the facility was so cool um they uh so
21:58
it originally was a saxs manufacturing center which made some of the earliest internally geared hubs which swam
22:05
purchased wow uh like 30 years ago or something like that a long time ago um
22:10
so they've been making bike parts I want to say since the 18 late 1800s wow
22:16
they've made bike parts in this facility that's cool so it has a ton of bike history they showed us all kinds of
22:22
internally geared hubs over the years and then they have a huge facility uh
22:27
for testing drivet train parts so they have all these crazy machines that are just running chains and drive chains and
22:33
shifting up and down for cycles and cycles and Cycles you know like 20,000
22:39
minutes or Cycles or whatever you want to call it um and yeah so it's lot of
22:44
testing going on you see that stuff and it's like yeah this is why not anyone can just make a drivetrain yeah because
22:50
these guys are just having you know 30 Engineers involved on this with 30
22:55
testers and people just you know testing every scenario and the weather is bad there so like I was just just starting
23:03
like you know tail end of fall beginning in Winter and like they're like oh yeah you think it sounds fun to be a tester
23:09
where you literally ride 5 to eight hours a day on a bike wait for the next three months it it's freezing the roads
23:14
are frozen and it's raining and they still have to do it it's actually almost more important to test in these months
23:20
than it is during the summer when it's nice so snarly yeah it was really cool
Cyccross World Cup
23:25
um hung out with svice uh you know maybe the goat of cyc cross racing uh cuz you
23:34
guys went to this cyclecross yeah he was he was there before um he was out swam facility and then yeah on Sunday swam
23:40
took us a little Vip Day to uh the cycle cross World Cup in the it was in Belgium
23:49
so um I don't know where in Belgium I probably couldn't pronounce it if I knew where um but yeah that's cool so we went
23:55
over in Belgium saw a cych cross World Cup race which is pretty wild the fans they are really into it um a lot of
24:01
people eating fries with mayo yeah that's the thing there yeah especially in Psych Frost the one of the big teams
24:07
that sponsor them is pows palas and that's their whole thing they're like food trucks with fries and Mayo so they
24:13
just like have these like uh look almost like a a fair ice cream cone but it's just fries with mayo just dumped all
24:20
over it wa it ain't my style but did you try because it can't be the same kind of mayo it's not just generic I don't know
24:28
I'm not really down I'm not Mayo whatever ever it's like their Mayo is like our Ranch in that regard you know
24:35
condt maybe they haven't tried ranch yet realize how much better it is I don't think they like Ranch in Europe I did I
24:41
did have a lot of a lot of beer there and I don't do beer so nice now when when you're when in Germany yeah Germany
24:47
and Belgium true so yeah that was kind of the gist of my trip it fun short quick nice made him back here nice
24:56
speaking of short and quick let's take a quick little break oo wow you think that
25:01
was good yeah and now a word from our sponsors hello everyone Jeff again I just wanted
Kettle Mountain
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called the Sierra Loft and a rainell called the B brella as in body umbrella
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rainshell jacket good stuff for the Winter thank you that's all and now back to the show Welcome listener questions
Travel Toolkit
26:02
listener questions I want to put together a travel toolkit for my car or for going
26:08
on bike trips I have a comprehensive set of tools at home but it is too much to
26:14
travel with what are your Essentials that you travel with PS why is Liam still in his pet rock phase
26:21
ouch it's not a phase Mom it's a lifestyle it's a pet rock lifestyle okay
26:27
yeah it's not a phasee mom it's a lifestyle this is a great question um well depends how
26:35
comprehensive you want basically I make a kit that if you want to change a rear
26:41
wheel or if you don't want to like I think that's the kind of the differentiator of like how comprehensive
26:48
the kit Chang like swapping cassettes and Stu mainly cassette stuff to take cassette off on and off so cuz you need
26:55
a cassette tool and a chain whip M of some sort whatever combination that might be um for me swapping rear wheels
27:03
when you travel is like kind of a necessity the way you know people break
27:09
rear rear wheels when the group that I ride with so I'm always looking you know
27:14
to travel with that and that's what my kit has otherwise I think a good set of really good
27:20
Allens and then also like uh WEA makes these little um like ratchet sets like
27:27
sometimes just send Jeff when he travels with his bike which is like you know pretty comprehensive ratchet set um but
27:34
the nice thing of having Allen's in addition to that ratchet set is a lot of pivot Hardware is two-sided right so um
27:42
you need that uh Tire levers um usually stuff to put on and off rotors some
27:49
stuff to kind of align brake rotors uh Tire levers help with that too to push
27:54
Pistons back and forth um it's kind of it like when we went to
28:01
Italy I didn't bring my full tool set I just ripped apart some of my stuff like
28:07
I didn't bring stuff to bring a rear wheel change because I was trying to be really minimal on what we were bringing
28:12
mhm so I think I'll just grab like Allen's Tire levers
28:19
Lube your tire pressure gauge tire pressure gauge shock pump and I think that's kind of it basically anything
28:25
like you know quick and dirty repair you know yeah like you know um I think I did
28:31
throw my hag tool in there so to hanger alignment gauge um so I think I threw
28:38
that in there just cuz that's easy to whack and get outline but yeah that's about it you could just look at the a
28:45
good multi-tool like a Crank Brothers 17 bit multi-tool and then just take the
28:51
larger version of those 17 tools wow cuz it's a lot more convenient to use those than the multi-tool way putting it or
28:58
just bring them both take the multi tool cuz you're going to ride with the multi-tool and just take the 17 of those things in the larger size wow also I
Click Floor Pump
29:05
brought that little Crank Brothers click floor pump I believe to Italy oh yeah
29:12
was a cool little G like a little bit bigger than your frame pump but you can pull it out and like get a pretty good pump up with it so it's got a little
29:18
foot thing too foot so you really get after it on the ground that's right yeah get after it on the ground get after it
29:24
on the ground that's what I'm talking about sounds like that's a pretty solid setup how about the next
29:29
question hi I were you going to say something no no go ahead okay cool yeah well go ahead hi I was wondering why not
29:35
to have a mullet setup on my bike thinking about upgrading if I am tubless and running an Enduro bike what are the fallbacks is climbing harder on a
29:42
mullet well wouldn't really say climbing is well I guess a little bit a little
29:47
bit of R less efficient you'll lack a little bit of rolling speed but I think mostly it's going to be what it does to
29:54
your bike is your bike set up for a mullet like flip chip like can you flip chip and reserve your Geo and your
30:00
pedaling characteristics and your pedaling position when going to Mullet if so drawbacks are pretty minimal like
30:06
besides the touch of rolling speed and rollover you know ability of the SM rear wheel um you know if you're really truly
30:14
like Enduro downhill focused like mullet might help you yeah enjoy it it's fun
30:20
probably enjoy it it's fun help don't really care how fast you're climbing you know enjoy a little more on
30:25
the if your bike isn't set up for it it might drastically change your Geo and you cannot just slap a 275 in wheel rear
30:32
wheel on a bike that's made for 29 M so I'd say that's that's basically the drawback right as your bike set up for
30:39
it and will retain stock characteristics or are you going to throw everything out
30:44
of whack just to have a smaller rear wheel that you know might make cornering a touch better but like everything else
30:50
worse yeah so for sure good points speaking of mm mismatched thing
30:58
oh boy I ride mismatched brand Wheels mismatched material and different brand tires how how do you like them apples oh
31:05
go those are oranges man cuz they're sour lemons thank you for the amazing content bring on more coffee talk dark
31:11
roast or light roast black or cream latte or espresso and also I'm joking you can ride whatever mismatch stuff you
31:18
feel yeah I I uh I realized some episodes back uh I thought we were being
31:23
gentle but clearly some people were a bit offended when we said we don't prefer or we we must have made some kind
31:30
of like or some snobby groan when we were talking about having mismatched Brand Tires um whatever we did people
31:38
did not like it I think a lot of people people are giving us a hard time yeah I know but I think people had I think
31:44
people felt uh personally attacked mismatch tires and they're like these guys said it was stupid to do that like
31:50
I don't am I am I not cool on the trail yeah maybe not by choice it's not it's not uh it's not something we would do or
31:57
we would prefer but it's obvious in in the grand scheme of Life on planet Earth it really doesn't matter so don't it
32:04
doesn't matter don't philosophically no does not matter don't worry about it if if you want to if you want to just end
32:09
up a Bike Snob or look cooler in front of a Bike Snob then yeah you're going to need so his question wasn't about
32:15
mismatched anything his question was actually about coffee though yeah it was about coffee I'm going to go uh dark
32:22
roast espresso uh you know what I just bought on Black Friday espresso machine an arrow press o nice have you seen the
32:29
espresso Forge though no oh don't even tell me about it I just I already I don't want to have virus remor well the
32:35
aerrow press is like way more affordable the forge is made by Sha near he used to be a Yeti Rider and it is like all cnced
32:44
super nice full it's like this tall with like a I don't know inch and a half cylinder uh I don't have one I just
32:51
really want one um but they look sick and same kind of thing you just compress it down yeah so it's like you know this
32:57
maybe I don't know espresso Forge you a foot and a half tall and you could just
33:02
press down and it makes a single espresso and it's all cnced made in the US super sick looking sounds cool a
33:10
press is awesome for like lightweight camping traveling like it's plastic right I also was just poking around on
33:16
Google and without doubt there you no matter what Rabbit Hole you go down
33:21
people are just saying you know the best coffee I've ever had came from an aero press like people just love and prefer the Flav no matter what hands down I'm
33:28
like I just got to get one of these yeah cuz it seems like a good way to make nice coffee I should actually get one of this for the van I wanted Forge yeah I
33:36
know how much was AER press 30 bucks 50 bucks I got the XL one which was I think
33:41
75 bucks yeah I think makes two cups of $400 yeah but um I would probably go
33:49
with like a medium roast espresso my preferred actually or I just addicted to Starbucks
33:56
cold brew mhm y I'm going to sell out for Starbucks bre straight up cold
34:01
brew sucker for like a creamy ice coffee or cold brew but like black hot coffee M
34:08
or sometimes cold yeah you know like a Nitro cold brew I don't really like the Nitro either you're not a Nitro guy see
34:14
I always not cold enough I kind of like kind of room temp I like a lot of things but I just change it up based on where I
34:22
am so if I'm at a cafe where I know someone knows how to pull a proper shot of espresso I'll absolutely get a
34:27
cortado or just a shot of espresso but if I'm at somewhere where I can tell like n no one really knows what they're
34:33
doing here I'll just be like yeah just give me a latte or just give me a cold RW or something simple or just give me a black coffee and I'll put a little half
34:39
and half in yeah Jeff thought he invented a mocha about 10 years ago he like I'm just going to put a little
34:44
chocolate powder in I think that was more like 20 years ago okay I I was at I was at a super cross race at uh Angel
34:53
Stadium in Anaheim I think I called it Anaheim Stadium and and Cody he's like it's Angel Stadium and he I looked over
34:59
at him he had a hat on I was like oh sorry I'm not a baseball guy my bad but
35:06
I've never been there for a baseball game but I've been there a dozen times for a Supercross race I think I must have been 15 years old and uh I had this
35:14
idea I was I was like thinking like when I was in line the little concession stand in the little janky Cafe in the
35:20
stadium and I was like I'm going to have ask if they can mix a hot chocolate and a coffee and I thought it was such a
35:26
good idea and so I go up there and I was like look this might be a total pain but is there any possible way you could mix a coffee
35:34
and a hot chocolate for me into one cup and the lady just looks at me and goes that's what a mocha
35:41
is and I go oh I didn't know that can I get that and she just like doesn't say
35:48
anything and just like Rings me up turns around and gives me the I was like I had no idea I used to do I used to do that
35:53
all the time though when I I think she maybe thought I was just being mean like I was trying to have like satire
35:59
derogatory humor like no I like honestly thought that I was inventing something I thought it was going to be great
36:05
nowadays she thought she'd be on Tik Tok or something yeah I used to do that for early morning rides when I was like 18
36:10
and I was trying to get to the group ride I wasn't really a full coffee like Drinker yet but like I was like still
36:16
like 700 a.m. and I was like 18 um and I'd literally do the kg I'd do one hot coffee or one hot chocolate and one hot
36:22
coffee in a cup and then ride to the group ride with a cup of coffee my hand like with a moch in my hand yeah wow but
36:30
yeah you know what it's all about right now is the peppermint hot chocolates I haven't had one PSL season is
36:36
over season's in dude in I already had one of course you did I lunch with
36:42
Taylor and she's like I think I'm going to go get a peppermint hot chocolate at Starbucks I was like I'm coming I'll have one peppermint mocha yeah I could
36:49
get a peppermint too late in the day for that but talk yeah now we're talking nice well speaking of mochas yeah let's
36:56
get back on the uh the bike trade you did ask us to talk about coffee they did yeah we we did all right I'm looking at
37:02
the Ibis rmo or rmo AF as my next bike I be doing a frame up build using parts off my old bike while I really noticed
37:09
the benefits of carbon for the added cost or would spending the extra cash on a carbon set of wheels or another
37:14
upgrade be more bang for the buck well you know we've kind of gone back and forth with this a few times in
37:20
the past um and I think speak for you guys as well when you go to theum frame
37:27
and you go with a little bit nicer suspension components and drivetrain brakes but it sounds like this guy's
37:33
already got Parts but maybe he'll upgrade him if he saves some money by going with the alloy
37:38
frame right yeah I mean I think it and when you start talking about like a ripmo right rmo is a 140 150 rear travel
Alloy vs Carbon
37:45
bike around there um I don't know the exact specs on a ripmo or ripmo AF and
37:50
if like Geo differs at all between the two mhm um but when you start kind of
37:56
getting in that range I think the carbon frames are so overbuilt and the alloy frames are just alloy that they're not
38:03
too much different in weight and I kind of I don't know I almost lean towards
38:08
the feeling of an alloy bike as a trail bike or and duro bike and yeah I just love nice components like I think
38:15
suspension brakes wheels and tires make a bigger difference than carbon or alloy
38:20
frames to me for sure in my my yeah that's kind of how I felt after adding
38:26
the bansi the other day I was like you could have blindfold me and tell me this is whatever material like honestly it
38:31
just it just felt amazing good Aluminum Bike feels nearly identical great yeah
38:37
totally i' totally say who cares on that too I used to be on the carbon train because they you know back in the day
38:43
were way lighter yeah um now they're not like they' kind of made aluminum lighter as it's gotten more refined and then
38:49
they've just made carbon thicker and heavier and more layers cuz they're worried about warranty issues so it's not certain bikes where you want to be
38:56
lighter like a 130 or under travel bike mhm but once you start getting above that like I don't know riding bikes that
39:03
weigh 32 35 lbs feel a little bit better and more planted in downhill scenarios so y you know that and that frame weight
39:11
is static right like you strap on your multi-tool your spares you know your
39:16
tube your big water bottle a coule you're adding 3 four lbs
39:22
right then and there so like did that pound you really saved on the carbon really make up for it like yeah
39:27
you know I don't know but that really light wheel set you'll feel and you'll notice super nice wheel set save the
39:32
money and go for a sick wheel set yeah and good suspension yeah I mean just all around good components make a huge
39:38
difference on a bike so I would totally favor having an alloy frame with way better Parts I would also say in in that
Balance
39:44
realm um I like balance in that sense like what I've what I've been bothered by over the years recently is if you
39:51
have a if you have kind of a frame that has maybe a slight bit more Flex than
39:57
other frames and then you have a crazy stiff wheel set or if you have a really stiff frame and then a kind of a flexi
40:03
is wheel set like I don't know those kind of things have bugged me lately so I kind of like to think all right let make sure to kind of balance this out
40:09
like based on the frame I don't want to go for one of those I'm really not interested in those super harsh rigid
40:15
Carbon wheels kind of want something where the frame and the wheels are kind of balanced together not neither one of
40:21
them is too stiff or too flexy compared to the other for sure yeah getting a little on the nerdy side there but I
40:26
mean good points nuances that I notice these days but that's what makes a bike ride good right like you hop on a bike
40:32
and it's like oh this bike feels really good and it's like why it's like I'm not really sure why but the package is well
40:38
packaged exactly it is greater than the sum of its parts it's funny enough that's something that talking to Adam
40:43
Miller the founder of Revel bikes he just kind of put in my head a lot cuz he was talking a lot about um you know in
40:50
the early days when we just started selling Revel and I met him and he was talking a lot about how they were working on balancing the bikes as the
40:56
the whole packages and the frames and you know getting the flex just right in the right spots but the stiffness right
41:01
in other spots and I was like wow he's really thought this stuff through and then I started becoming more
41:08
aware of that and then noticing it more on the different bikes I rode and yeah it is it is an important thing to pay
41:14
attention to as you go further down the rabbit hole of like getting the bike just the right way you want it for sure
41:20
totally well next question shy what is the most useless skill you possess
41:27
well Jared since you said you knew yours what is yours yeah I'll go first um so you know like if you're drinking you
41:33
know like soda or beer out of a can and you get down to like that point where it's maybe like a quarter or a third of the way full uhhuh and then like can
41:40
balance it on the edge like that that's probably the most useless skill that I
41:46
have is that a skill though or is that just like you understood physics once
41:51
yeah I don't know it's so hard what what a skill is or isn't I think all skills are val it's technically a skill I mean
41:58
call it a party trick whatever you want but balance can well in that case I can open a beer bottle or I do a lot more uh
42:05
coke uh me bottle Cokes these days yeah with my ring but that's
42:11
useful yeah it's not useless is it that's too useful it's too useful
42:16
something more useless than that mhm well ular tires yeah mine mine that has now become
42:23
useless is uh I'm pretty good at bloming tubular tires which most Mal bikers
42:29
wouldn't even know what the heck those are why am I gluing my tires on yeah so like pretty when I first started
42:35
wrenching I wrenched for this small Race shop and uh we had a master's crit team so like every couple weeks I was Glu
42:41
tubular tires and wrapping handlebars and like replacing derailer caes so I even want to give just a quick overview
42:47
what a tubular tire is and why it has tubular tire is an entire basically Road tire they're a
Tubular Tires
42:54
little bit on mountain bike Nino used to race them up until maybe six years ago dugast tubular tires um it's it's a tire
43:02
that is a complete like Circle sealed Circle uh rubber all around and then the
43:08
bottom is uh cotton and they they also call them seans because they sew the cotton to the
43:16
rubber tire um so they also call them seans uh then you glue that to a rim
43:22
which doesn't have a channel for your your beads to sit in it's just basically like a triangle flat on top little
43:29
curved surface and you glue that on there so your tire is literally glued to the rim um what it does is it there's no
43:38
sidewalls and rims and Beads so it's really comfortable um so you can run pretty low
43:45
pressures it has it had much better traction than bikes with tubes in them
43:51
in regular like Clincher style setups um and they were able to make lighter rims
43:56
but such has technology surpassed that uh probably passed that a long time ago but no one wants to give stuff up right
44:03
away uh they are now Obsolete and barely ever used so a little bit in the in the Pro Tour still but they're mostly still
44:09
on they're mostly on Tess setups now it's still used on the track and melrone but wow I heard that might get pulled
44:16
out of the Olympics and if that's pulled out of Olympics then that's disappearing what yeah because it's become such an
44:22
equipment race that only a couple countries that pour a ton of budget into it can actually compete because they're
44:28
so aerodynamic focused now and you need that that X company X country that doesn't have this massive government
44:35
funding track racing you know that makes sense yeah if you can't afford so that's my useless skill what's yours
44:41
Jee I don't know anything more useless than that uh you know the back of
44:47
Disneyland map think the back of your head maybe maybe knowing how to uh
44:53
transfer a lot of data from an Android phone to an iPhone and vice versa not that many people need that skill I'd
45:00
still call that pretty useful that's pretty useful we need more useless than that like you said you're doing like Tai Chi or something or oh chiong chiong
45:07
chiong yeah at some point I I was at a conference and one of the guys there he actually really interesting entrepreneur
45:14
he sort of brought chiong which is similar to taiichi he brought that whole exercise to the United States and made a
45:20
whole business of uh selling curriculum and a subscription course and making class
45:26
and wow it's it's cool it's sort of a it's sort of a combination between yoga and taii I guess you could say it's a
45:32
little bit more active and movement and it's about stretching um oh that's a random I guess that's a use that's
45:39
useful skill though when I was doing that more I was but you're not using it anymore flexible I was more limber I
45:45
should start doing it more it's pretty fun then it would be useful yeah there you go true nice I like that yeah all right
45:53
difference between useful and useless is is objective that's true subjective not
46:00
objective objective is scientifically proven with data and facts and you can
46:06
subjective is more opinionated let's move on J next question is that OB making sure you had that correct is
46:11
objective for a sub can't mix those ones up oh my gosh all right next question deer worldwide celery I know people are
46:19
going to think this is NAD but it's not I live in Jeff's Leaf's favorite state the state of Ohio and as it's cooling
46:24
down I'm looking for some good active pants for trail riding can you walk me through some of the differences between
46:29
your pant offerings specifically I require generous cut blah blah blah I'm
46:34
wondering if you could speak to how these pants may fit and if there are differences between them in their overall fitment PS does Jeff weight
46:42
weeny worry about how heavy his clothes are or only his Spike bar it goes way farther than that oh
46:50
yeah they just see my wallet your yeah your wallet your wallet your uh your tra travel kit is lightweight yeah he's got
46:58
he has started adding way more weight to his travel kit though some things he brought a speaker somewhere dude I
47:04
thought I would never in a million years do that and then I got that little Sono speaker and I was like this is really
47:10
nice to travel with I just like I'm just going to carry it well out a speaker
47:16
somewhere I was like that I think you were in Canada and I was like you part of me is on your bike I shocked when I
47:22
saw that well part of me is like ah I'm just going to be super lightweight minimalist and the other part of me is like well you know what I'm going to
47:28
carry a big heavy backpack because it's good exercise and I want to get more exercise and people carry heavy things I want to carry heavy things put all stuff
47:34
in my backpack so I have these two two arguments in my head like I'll just take yeah I got room for the speaker I'll
47:40
take the speaker too so I don't know it depends on the trip oh it's great um as
Product Development Challenges
47:45
far as the kettle pants this this is a hard challenge because when we we getting into the apparel business and
47:51
this is like any product based business you know you you always make these different products and as the product
47:58
developer and designer you get so intimately familiar with the products and the differences and you understand
48:03
all of it because you see it you designed it and you don't realize that once you bring this stuff to Market people just see three pairs of pants or
48:10
three petals or three grips and are like oh what what the difference here and and then you start explaining it and then
48:16
you realize like wait my explanations aren't making sense because I'm just so far removed from in the weeds the the
48:22
newer the newcomer to these products so I know it is a challenge we we recently updated the kettle website to where um
48:30
if you you go to you know the pants collection it has the three pairs of pants right at the top and then it gives
48:35
you a little snippet sentence and then three bullet points of what it is for and what it's like for all three
48:41
different pairs we did that with the tops too and the shorts so I don't know we're trying to do these things same thing with the trail one site we try to
48:47
do it with the stems right like here the clear differences of the stems grip which when it comes to bike parts it's
Apparel
48:53
almost easier in some sense cuz price points people kind of understand what it is based on the price point when it
48:58
comes to certain things like apparel you have three pairs of pants that are all similar in weight and yeah so anyways to
49:05
actually answer this guy's question um the fit is not all that different on these three pairs of pants so the we've
49:12
gone with a somewhat tapered fit for all the all the pants um off the bat and
49:18
then we're going to offer a relaxed fit version as sort of an additional thing which is coming next spring um yeah
49:25
because like we wanted to make the you know a small brand you can only make so many fitments off the bat and then you
49:30
got to add more inseams and colors and different styles of fit and things like that later um but they're all bit
49:36
tapered um and yeah I'll just refer you to go look at our newly designed thing that tells you the difference between
49:42
them the shenanigan pant as rote on here durable lightweight outdoor pant the Tom
49:48
Foolery Chino pant versatile travel pant and the vent lightweight pant is a featherweight jogger active pant that's
49:55
what I'm wearing right now it's also the lightest weight one jogger is so jerish I love that word he said for riding and
50:01
if I just had to pick one for riding I'd probably shoot shenanigan um is it's made out of same
50:07
material as our skidmark pants correct yeah the skid shorts yeah they're all three different
50:13
fabric and different designs um and I rode in the shenanigan pant uh both days
50:19
last weekend did you I did a shuttle day and a pedal day did you oh yeah yeah good they're good enjoyed it yeah the
50:25
Shen I mean none of the pants for Kettle are mountain bikes specific like we'll
50:31
we'll get there at some point but um we did that make mountain bike specific shorts and a jersey and stuff but for
50:37
the pants we're worried about other categories that we want to Target first so we'll get to a mountain bike specific
50:42
thing but if you want to just go straight up um you know right now with the pants yeah shenanigan pants as you
50:48
said Liam work pretty good that's a super durable fabric if I was going to tell someone a mountain bike in any of them I would say the same thing and it
50:53
has the most your waste closure closure
50:59
system that wraps all the way around as well which is super nice for outdoor activities and riding a bike love it I
51:05
love my skid mark shorts yeah those things have really taken off probably my favorite pair of mountain bike shorts have gone also I don't know what I said
51:12
about Ohio but it's not my least favorite state what is I don't know I I don't want to send anything someone's
51:18
going to be authentic all right time for one more question I think quickly um all right
51:23
carbon aluminum they get all the do you ever consider steel when thinking of a new bike PS via Bean the cat I love
51:31
that um yeah actually that ree that we had in the shop was cool and the
51:37
production privy part Steel part carbon yep um that bike rips I love that production preview
51:45
too which we have some in stock wow yeah do we really that is cool those things are red so if you want an extremely rare
51:52
off-the-wall bike that you can be rest assured no one else is going to have at any given trail head any day in North
51:57
America production previews rats making amazing bikes we got to actually meet the the designer and developer of those
52:03
bikes yeah um and we were out in Andora and they're killer it's it that is a unique interesting setup doing carbon
52:09
rear end steel front end totally that is cool yeah I don't know i' I'm uh steel
52:15
curious steel curious I I would I'm also steel curious also still curious that
52:20
ree came in we built up a re that looked really that bike looked what model was that was the SST SST is like a 120 130
52:29
rear travel bike with like a 130 140 Fork yeah and it it hopped I hopped on it and I rode it through the parking lot
52:35
I was like wo this is feels like a big BMX bike like I would love to feels solid have some fun on this and just see
52:41
what it felt like so yeah um yeah we have considered steel we're all still curious we're still curious and I know
52:48
Nico tried steo out for his downhill bike and he said there's some really cool characteristics with that um that
52:56
he I think he put went to put into his alloy bike um by trying that steel front
53:01
end so yeah still curious here yeah worldwide Ste curious there's something
53:06
cool about just like the durability and like the forever aspect to some of these Metals you know that like you don't really get that kind of like character
53:12
from carbon a lot of the time you know like from those like the metal you just kind of get that like I know almost
53:17
handmade even though it probably wasn't handmade pretty sure those are made by Road Bots right the the production privy steel ones partly part partly production
53:25
pries are actually made by a like like a five or maybe more than five AIS uh
53:32
welding J welding robot and then finished by hand but that's cool it's really cool the way they can do that I
53:38
don't know how the rebs are made at all super cool but yeah you know I mean you just get that feel like that it's been
53:44
you know manufactured with care and like more personal feel yeah so in other words yes we are considering Ste we're
53:50
also considering ending the show thank you very much for listening genuinely appreciate it uh yeah seriously thank
53:58
you thank you and uh we're gonna have some more guests coming in next year it's GNA be awesome we're going to have
54:03
our MTB trending products of the entire year coming out in early January got a lot of stuff on the docket so stay tuned
54:10
albe it's the offseason mountain bike media is pumping yeah it is thank you
54:16
please leave us a five star review on Apple or Spotify podcast we really appreciate it and if you screenshot the review and send it over to podcast
54:22
worldwi cy.com Jared will give you a present yes I will actually and send us any questions to podcast at
54:27
worldwide.com we appreciate that thank you and goodbye thank you and good night good night and good luck love you good
54:33
night and good luck was that the Anchor Man one good night and good luck oh I don't know that's from actually and that's the way the cookie that's the way
54:40
the cookie [Music]
54:50
Crum